Help Needed! ON GOING STAPH SKIN PROBLEM

[Bella Bluenoser]

I am back regarding Bella’s ON GOING “apparent staph’ skin infection that she gets one or twice every year usually between December and April. She started showing signs of reoccurring about mid April. The first thing I did was bath her using Nizoral shampoo to kill the bacteria and get the loose hair and scabs off of her and give her some comfort from the itching, I then applied coconut oilI to her bare skin and a week ago I started her on Clavulin C12 (amoxicillin) antibiotic pills, 875mg daily (half a pill after breakfast and half a pill after supper) and 75mg of Benadryl daily (25mg 3 times per day, she is 80lbs). I have been bathing her weekly using the Nizoral shampoo and each time more hair and scabs come off of her, after yesterday’s bath her back has a large area of bare skin, see attached picture (I hope). I haven’t used the coconut oil on her skin after the last two baths, I’m not sure why. Bella gets probiotics (tripe) daily and has been for some time, for years she has been on a small dosage (5mg every 3 days) of Prednisone to keep another issue she has from flaring up. This time on the antibiotics and Benadryl she is much more interested in food then ever before, I am not sure if it is the antibiotics or the Benadryl that is causing her to be hungry, it doesn’t really matter, at this stage I am not concerned about her weight. If anyone can suggest something else I can do or change I am interested in hearing about it.

 

[nubonics]

Sorry to hear about this reoccuring issue. It is most likely the small dosage of Prednisone that is making her hungry

Curious, do you do a daily fish oil pill (1000mg)? Our French bulldog mix had the worst skin problems (we took him to a dermatologist, did an allergy test and he was allergic to everything under the sun) and a preventative measure that work was a fish oil pill

The Dermatologist also told has us that Zyrtec works better than Benedryl

Good luck!

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[helsonwheels]

[MENTION=17858]Bella Bluenoser[/MENTION], way too much meds. Her immune system as we say is shot. She needs to build up her good “ flora gut” or she’ll never be able to heal. I personally would get NuStock n apply on affected area. It smells but it works great.

Start giving her a tablespoon per day with her meals fermented sauerkraut or veggies to build up the good flora in her gut. She needs the good probiotics from the fermented foods. I prefer giving/taking probiotics from real food. The tripe you give, is it the smelly one or the white rubbery one you buy at the grocery stores? And yes fish oil is good too BUT ask where the fish oil is made from. Stay away from Asia’s water fish. Full of mercury.

 

[nubonics]

[MENTION=15310]helsonwheels[/MENTION] good catch! Yes, stay away from Asia. We get the Nature Made brand that is sourced from Peru. encapsulated and quality tested in USA

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[Dollys Owner]

I would bathe her with a combination chlorhexidine/ketoconazole shampoo such as Ketohex or Curaseb, as ketoconazole ( Nizoral ) is anti fungal and won't kill any staph.

As Helsonwheels mentioned, a good probiotic such as raw fermented sauerkraut or other fermented vegetable from refrigerator section of health food store or supermarket, milk kefir, or a doggie probiotic such as Probiotic Miracle or Proviable DC would be beneficial.

You might also give turmeric with some pepper or turmeric paste, and oral organic virgin coconut oil to help with allergies.



Cetirizine (Zyrtec ) dose for dogs is 0.5 mg/pound once per day.

You might want to consider switching to frozen raw food as well.

 

[Lalaloopsie]

Your antibiotic seems to be right, but If you won’t see any improvement in one more week, discuss with vet change to another one. I presume they didn’t perform sensitivity test on his bacteria, so sometimes Staph is more aggressive strain which is not sensitive to certain antibiotic.

Staphylococci are secondary to underlying skin condition, every healthy dog and human has plenty of Staph on their skin, but only some get infection. Usual primay reasons for skin weakness against Staph is 1) allergies 2) Omega3 responsive skin condition.
She already gets bunch or antiallerdic medication, but it obviously doesn’t help much. I would concentrate on choosing the most expensive Fish oil you can afford for her. And not just any fish oil, look for the one that says on label “with high content of DHA and EPA”. It is Omega 3 fatty acids.

My dog got several courses of antibiotics for his Staph and NOTHING helped unless he started to get every day special fish oil with high DHA and EPA content (unfortunately I can not recommend brand as I got it from South Africa and my experience with USA made fish oils was dicey). But I can promise you, 99% sure your dog has Omega 3 responsive skin condition. If you won’t compensate it with fish oil, nothing will help. After improvement my dog went back to Staph in couple of weeks after stopping antibiotics. For now AB are a necessary evil, because her skin is really bad, but you have to compensate real reason for this.

Together with fish oil it is good to give her not not every day but may be 2 times a week human Vitamin A 8000 ME, Vitamin E 400 ME and smallest possible dose of Zync - May be quarter of a 8 mg tablet. All these components are crucial for skin (just look at your facial creams, all Vit A and E, Zync is used for acne treatment etc). And fish oil increases need in Vit E.

Don’t wash her too often. Her skin is already extremely damaged and washing, especially with antibiotics/antifungal shampoos just makes it more irritated. If I were you, I would absolutely follow Dollys Owner advice and change to shampoo with Chlorhexidine and Ketokonazol. But use shampoo a little bit later when she will improve a bit. For now, I wouldn’t wash her back at all and would buy in Walmart simple Neosporin ointment and apply it every second day to keep area moist and antibiotics in it will help a bit too. With infection so bad Coconut oil is too weak.

Antibiotics irritate stomach walls and because they kill gut bacteria, it makes their bowels even more upset, and they definitely feel more hungr. Now it is not a time for strict restrictions, may be introduce some small lunch for her in the middle of the day.

Whatever she eats, may be try to look in the direction of raw food or home cooking. I wish her speedy recovery!

 

[Lalaloopsie]

By the way, Prednisone is actually a powerful immune suppressor. All steroids are. Is it absolutely necessary?
I also cannot understand why someone who gets prednisone needs Benadryl. I think it is very strange combo, because on its own Prednisone suppresses immune system to the extent there is no need for Benadryl. I would quit Benadryl, unless she has a lot of itch?...
i wonder what Dolly’s Owner would say about this combo?...
please someone clever tag Dollys Owner to read this, I’m too stupid, don’t know how insert people’s names in my post so they read it

 

[Dollys Owner]

By the way, Prednisone is actually a powerful immune suppressor. All steroids are. Is it absolutely necessary?
I also cannot understand why someone who gets prednisone needs Benadryl. I think it is very strange combo, because on its own Prednisone suppresses immune system to the extent there is no need for Benadryl. I would quit Benadryl, unless she has a lot of itch?...
i wonder what Dolly’s Owner would say about this combo?...
please someone clever tag Dollys Owner to read this, I’m too stupid, don’t know how insert people’s names in my post so they read it

I would agree not much point in adding an antihistamine on top of prednisone, except for the sedative effect of the benadryl, or for very specific conditions like urticaria or mastocytosis.

Is there any way you can tell us why Bella is on long term low dose steroid therapy? It could definitely be contributing to the staph problem. In humans polymalgia rheumatica or prevention of transplant rejection or lupus are the common reasons we see long term prednisone use.

Staph is potentially transmissable to you so make sure you disinfect her bedding, toys etc and don't let her on furniture or your bed. Clean surfaces with bleach or a good disinfectant like Lysol.

Another good rinse for her instead of chlorhexidine, to which there is some resistance developing , is very dilute bleach- in humans we use 1 teaspoon per gallow of water, for 15 min twice weekly for up to 3 months.

If it's methicillin resistant staph aureus like Lalapoopsie was alluding to when she mentioned "has sensitivity testing been done", clavulin won't work- you would have to use different antibiotics such as rifampin, cotrimoxazole or doxycyline. Just mentioning it so you can talk to vet if the infection is not clearing up.

 

[cefe13]

Poor Bella; I hope you will soon find a cure. Castor's experience of staph infections is limited but we have been told by vets to use chlorehexidine shampoo for skin issues and that seems to work whatever the problem has been (hotspot, furunculosis, staph infection). I also second suggestions above to give salmon oil. We used to give Castor salmon oil when he was young but then I somehow forgot. I started giving him salmon oil again half a year ago. The result is good: no furunculosis, coat looks great and above all, for the very first time in his six years, Castor has gone through a whole winter without an ear infection.

 

[Dollys Owner]

If you give salmon oil you have to give the Vitamin E like Lalapoopsie mentioned, unless the salmon oil has vitamin e in it.

I was giving my dog Costco Kirkland brand salmon oil from capsules, but switched to giving her canned sardines in water, then switched to frozen smelt when I read that the sardines could have some radiation from Fukushima. My dog never had hotspots or staph infections, just food and environmental allergies with ear infections and licking of paws, and that cleared up when I switched her to frozen raw dog food. Perhaps some other members can comment if giving fish helped their dogs with skin problems as well, in case you want an alternative to giving fish oil. I know members in past have commented they like Grizzly brand and Nordic Naturals brand of salmon oil.

 

[Bella Bluenoser]

[MENTION=17858]Bella Bluenoser[/MENTION], way too much meds. Her immune system as we say is shot. She needs to build up her good “ flora gut” or she’ll never be able to heal. I personally would get NuStock n apply on affected area. It smells but it works great.

Start giving her a tablespoon per day with her meals fermented sauerkraut or veggies to build up the good flora in her gut. She needs the good probiotics from the fermented foods. I prefer giving/taking probiotics from real food. The tripe you give, is it the smelly one or the white rubbery one you buy at the grocery stores? And yes fish oil is good too BUT ask where the fish oil is made from. Stay away from Asia’s water fish. Full of mercury.

Thank you for your suggestions, she is on green tripe, check it out on the link -https://www.totallyrawdogfood.com/product/totally-ground-green-tripe/

 

[helsonwheels]

Thank you for your suggestions, she is on green tripe, check it out on the link -https://www.totallyrawdogfood.com/product/totally-ground-green-tripe/

Good stuff! And everyone has given you great suggestions.

I personally would start with only a couple different things at a time so I can determine what doesn’t work. When too much is thrown in as meds, you’ll never know what’s going on. Your vet is giving way too much meds here. Do use the shampoo suggest by [MENTION=16884]Dollys Owner[/MENTION] n add NuStock. Do your baby steps. Btw everyone is right about prednisone...is it necessary? I know I’m not for any antibiotics unless it’s a life n death issue. But that’s me.

 

[2BullyMama]

Fantastic advice and info from the team... get off the predizone and get her immune system back up and strong.

We may have asked this before and apologize if so... but what food and protein are you feeding


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[Bella Bluenoser]

Thank you for all of the suggestions, it is very much appreciated.

On your advice I stopped giving Bella the Benadryl.

Yesterday I started giving Bella 1000mg soft gels of wild salmon & fish oil, it is an Omega 3 complex that has 100mg of EPA and DHA made in Canada by Jamieson that I happen to take daily.

Is 100mg of EPA & DHA high content ?

Is it ok to give it to her in the soft gel jacket ?

Is a 1000mg daily the correct dosage ?

I will continue giving her the Clavulin antibiotics until I reach the 2 weeks on May 16th.

I am strongly consider switching her to frozen raw dog, the place I get the tripe “Totally Raw” sells it.

I will get some NuStock and apply on affected areas asap.

I will add the fermented sauerkraut to her daily diet.

The tripe she gets is the good tripe.

I will add the fermented sauerkraut to her daily diet.

Bella already gets oral organic virgin coconut oil.

Because many of you are concerned about the Prednisone I will explain why Bella is on a very mild dosage of Prednisone. Bella gets 5mg Prednisone every 3 days because she has Masticatory muscle myositis, it is an inflammatory myopathy. When she first started having this problem around 4 years old (about six years ago) we would give her the Prednisone as prescribed by the vet, as you likely know you start off with a high dosage which in her case was 80mg and reduce it by half every two weeks but we found that the problem would reoccur every 3 months when she was off of the Prednisone plus the high dosage of Prednisone had nasty side effects so after almost two years of this I decided to find another solution. After studying this on my own and against my vets advise I decided to find as low of a maintenance dosage that I could find that would keep the problem at bay and have her on the Prednisone forever rather than having her on the high dosage every 3 months and have the problem continually return.

 

[Dollys Owner]

The dose sounds a bit low, I've seen anywhere from 25-65 mg/kg EPA plus DHA per day recommended. I think your salmon oil capsules are too low to give that amount, since each capsule only has 100mg. If you look at Nordic Natural wild anchovy and sardine oil they advise 1426 mg EPA and DHA per day for a 40-59 pound dog.

In terms of capsules, you can either poke it open and squeeze onto food or serve it whole if your dog will swallow it.