Help Needed! Non Stop Allergy Issues

[helsonwheels]

[MENTION=16943]kevin1005[/MENTION] im in the food industry and not a fan of anything that is raw. BUT....yes there's a BUT..... in your case go raw so you heal your boy faster, do that blood test, get another vet as yours seems to be wasting your money. Once under control if you like and maybe or not, you can look into Honest Kitchen or just stay as is.

 

[Cbrugs]

I don't have an EB yet (but will at the end of April!!) but I do have a Frenchie that is allergic to everything green outside (we did a skin test) as well as having some food issues (trial and error) so I can say I know what you are going through. Jax developed allergies just before he turned 1 and he will be 4 in April. He has been on Apoquel since then and he cannot go a day without it. He also gets biweekly allergy shots. After trying several different kinds of high quality kibble, I finally decided to go raw and while it did not cure everything, I can say without a doubt that it has helped. Raw helps boost the immune system. There are a lot of proteins that Jax cannot have as he gets itchy but Vital Essentials is a good brand and it is already balanced with the appropriate meat/bone/organ ratio.

I also give Jax a bath every Sunday with a medicated shampoo. I usually rotate between Ketohex and Chlorhexidine 4% shampoo. On top of that, I use chlorhexedine wipes as needed to wipe under his pits as that is where he usually gets itchy. Bathing and wiping him down has become part of our routine and it is what it is but I am now able to keep everything under control and (knock on wood) he only goes to his dermatologist for his yearly exam. Once you get everything figured out and get it under control, it is much easier to maintain.

If your girl is licking and chewing her paws a lot, you can try an iodine paw soak.

Good luck!

 

[kevin1005]

This is very important...and sometimes that hardest thing to do. The period of time that you bulldog is off the Pred depends on the type of test. For the skin test it's longer. Taking Hamilton off the only med that's giving him any relief for 6+ weeks can be painful to live with, for you and him. If Hamilton is taking Apoquel then there's likely no waiting period before either type of testing...Doc may require 2 days at the most.
For the blood testing, antihistamines do not need to be stopped, however, I've read where some say 1-2 weeks. For skin test antihistamines need to be stopped for 2 weeks.

The path that will best serve Hamilton is to get him on Apoquel right away [after]making sure that he has NO active skin/ear infection. Move forward with the blood testing. Stop the guessing and end his suffering. I want to see Hamilton happy and looking his best...and not on Predisone long term.

Well so my wife called the Allergy Specialist today, she said she can not recommend any raw food diets.. It's so frustrating hearing different ways to do something. So this is what she said, the blood testing will only show environmental allergies and not show food allergies, or at least the test that shows food she says is not accurate and useless. Shes recommends
1. doing the bloodwork to start the apoquel
2 doing a NEW food trial for 2 months consisting of Lentils and Quinoa.
3. Stopping the other supplements I bought this week.

SO I guess i have no choice but to follow at this point. I'm hoping he's not allergic to lentils or Quinoa, which I guess there's no way to know that until we take another 2 months and try this new diet.

In a 2 hour conversation last night with my wife she mentioned how the Allergist wanted to start him on Apoquel first, but the side effects are unknown because it is rather new, and the expense of blood work was too much after having his second $3000 eye surgery. I think that's why we orginally went the route of trying these other pills first, not knowing that there would be absolutely no help from any of them. I don't want to be slowly killing him will pills. That's my biggest fear. I look in his drawer and he has probably 20 containers of pills through his life, like clearly we are missing something. I'm an electrician, not a veterinarian, so what do i know? Maybe there's 100 ways to get to a stable place for him, but i feel like we've tried so many already and failed, so I'm pessimistic.

 

[Cbrugs]

Well so my wife called the Allergy Specialist today, she said she can not recommend any raw food diets.. It's so frustrating hearing different ways to do something. So this is what she said, the blood testing will only show environmental allergies and not show food allergies, or at least the test that shows food she says is not accurate and useless. Shes recommends
1. doing the bloodwork to start the apoquel
2 doing a NEW food trial for 2 months consisting of Lentils and Quinoa.
3. Stopping the other supplements I bought this week.

SO I guess i have no choice but to follow at this point. I'm hoping he's not allergic to lentils or Quinoa, which I guess there's no way to know that until we take another 2 months and try this new diet.

In a 2 hour conversation last night with my wife she mentioned how the Allergist wanted to start him on Apoquel first, but the side effects are unknown because it is rather new, and the expense of blood work was too much after having his second $3000 eye surgery. I think that's why we orginally went the route of trying these other pills first, not knowing that there would be absolutely no help from any of them. I don't want to be slowly killing him will pills. That's my biggest fear. I look in his drawer and he has probably 20 containers of pills through his life, like clearly we are missing something. I'm an electrician, not a veterinarian, so what do i know? Maybe there's 100 ways to get to a stable place for him, but i feel like we've tried so many already and failed, so I'm pessimistic.

May I ask if the vet stated why she could not recommend a raw diet? My first reaction would be to say to find a new vet. I can attest to a raw diet helping Jax with his allergies. As stated, it didn't cure everything but it has definitely helped. I can also say that Jax would be a mess without Apoquel. Before he started the Apoquel he was on Temeril-P which is a steroid. Long term steroid use is not good. As of right now, there are no known long term affects with Apoquel.

 

[oscarmayer]

...she said she can not recommend any raw food diets.

You don't need her permission to feed Hamilton a raw diet. Try it for 2 weeks and see what happens. It won't hurt him in the least.

1. doing the bloodwork to start the apoquel...

I have NEVER had a Vet ask to do bloodwork before dispensing Apoquel. Makes me think they are upselling and lining their pockets at your expense. What in the world would they be looking for that would disqualify Hamilton as an Apoquel candidate? Did they do a blood test before recommending Prednisone?

...after having his second $3000 eye surgery.

The most we've ever paid for bi-lateral Entropian surgery was $2K. My wife said she's heard of Vets in and around the DC area(where she used to live) charging as much as $3k. For you to have spent $6000.00 on eye-surgeries is astonishing. Has he had corneal transplant surgery?

 

[kevin1005]

May I ask if the vet stated why she could not recommend a raw diet? My first reaction would be to say to find a new vet. I can attest to a raw diet helping Jax with his allergies. As stated, it didn't cure everything but it has definitely helped. I can also say that Jax would be a mess without Apoquel. Before he started the Apoquel he was on Temeril-P which is a steroid. Long term steroid use is not good. As of right now, there are no known long term affects with Apoquel.

She just stated that she's not familiar with any raw food diet so she can't recommend a path in that direction. I know I've kind of thrown her under the bus a little, but I have heard several people have good results using her. She's our allergy specialist not our ordinary vet. My question is if we do this new food trial won't the apoquel calm his symptoms, so how will we know if it's the food or the pills? AND, doing the 2 month food trial to what end? He's not going to eat quinoa and lentils for the rest of his life, I can't imagine that being a balanced meal. I don't know, maybe I just want results now, and obviously it doesn't work like that.

 

[kevin1005]

You don't need her permission to feed Hamilton a raw diet. Try it for 2 weeks and see what happens. It won't hurt him in the least.

I have NEVER had a Vet ask to do bloodwork before dispensing Apoquel. Makes me think they are upselling and lining their pockets at your expense. What in the world would they be looking for that would disqualify Hamilton as an Apoquel candidate? Did they do a blood test before recommending Prednisone?

The most we've ever paid for bi-lateral Entropian surgery was $2K. My wife said she's heard of Vets in and around the DC area(where she used to live) charging as much as $3k. For you to have spent $6000.00 on eye-surgeries is astonishing. Has he had corneal transplant surgery?

Welcome to Connecticut. He had 2 surgeries for his eye lids rolling in (can't think of the official name)
She wants to do the bloodwork to get a baseline of liver aND kidney function to monitor the effects of the apoquel. It seemed reasonable to me.

I believe Hamilton is worst case scenario in almost every area. All the vets have said they've never met a dog like him, so we may be dealing with a very unique situation.

 

[helsonwheels]

[MENTION=16943]kevin1005[/MENTION] Im lost here. So the test was just for environmental? Why would the food allergy test be useless? Is this vet for real.... Kevin get H on raw diet plz. Nothing will happen to him. Its food n its all natural...like all their ancestors was eating before kibbles was introduced. Never seen a wolf eat quinoa.

 

[kevin1005]

[MENTION=16943]kevin1005[/MENTION] Im lost here. So the test was just for environmental? Why would the food allergy test be useless? Is this vet for real.... Kevin get H on raw diet plz. Nothing will happen to him. Its food n its all natural...like all their ancestors was eating before kibbles was introduced. Never seen a wolf eat quinoa.

I'm sorry I haven't been very descriptive. There are two blood work tests one blood work test to get his Baseline liver and kidney function before he goes on the apoquel.

The second blood work test is to test for allergies but she said it would only be testing Environmental allergies not food related allergies. I had the initial same thought about the quinoa. But I have been reading about it today and some people say it is pretty healthy for dogs.

 

[Cbrugs]

You can mix in quinoa with the raw which will help cut back on the amount of actual meat fed if cost is an issue. I couldn't imagine feeding just lentils and quinoa even if it's for a short amount of time. It's not balanced. Where are all of the needed nutrients. You have a concern of starting Apoquel and giving raw at the same time as you won't know if it's the food or pills working. If you start raw and he does well on it, then why not just keep him on raw. If he continues to do well while on raw and taking Apoquel, then one day don't give the Apoquel and see what happens. Jax cannot go a day without taking an Apoquel. There has been a couple of occasions where I forgot to give him one or he spit it and he became so itchy. The effects of the Apoquel generally last around 18 - 24 hours. I know right away if I forget to give him.

I do remember Jax getting blood work a couple times during the 1st year or so of being on Apoquel to make sure everything was normal.

If I didn't do everything I am doing (raw, Apoquel, allergy shots, weekly baths, etc.), Jax would be a miserable mess. You just have to get everything under control and then maintain.

 

[kevin1005]

If I didn't do everything I am doing (raw, Apoquel, allergy shots, weekly baths, etc.), Jax would be a miserable mess. You just have to get everything under control and then maintain.

At least I know I'm not the only one doing a ton of things for my dog. I'm glad you have it under control, and that there's hope for us. I am going t discuss the raw diet with my wife again tomorrow and make a decision...

 

[kevin1005]

Just as an update if anyone is interested we are starting Honest Kitchen's Base mix today with quinoa. Our plan is if he's doing ok with that after we fully switch over for a week or so we are going to give turkey a try with the honest kitchen. He seems to negatively respond pretty quickly to something if it doesn't agree with him so I'm hoping to be able to know pretty quickly if it's doing good. Thank you to everyone who gave us advise. I'm hoping we are finally moving in the right direction. I'm hoping to start the Apoquel in the next few weeks as well. I'll give an update soon.

Thanks

 

[jsisson151]

We have had great success with Taste of the Wild Grain Free dry dog food. Royal Canin made Carmine's skin allergies flare up. After numerous trials of food, Tast of the Wild has really helped. Also, on weekends, we add a raw diet. I have also found that a cap full of raw, organic, apple cider vinegar in his water bowl really helps (also helps with the smell) and coconut oil after his baths help too.

 

[helsonwheels]

Just as an update if anyone is interested we are starting Honest Kitchen's Base mix today with quinoa. Our plan is if he's doing ok with that after we fully switch over for a week or so we are going to give turkey a try with the honest kitchen. He seems to negatively respond pretty quickly to something if it doesn't agree with him so I'm hoping to be able to know pretty quickly if it's doing good. Thank you to everyone who gave us advise. I'm hoping we are finally moving in the right direction. I'm hoping to start the Apoquel in the next few weeks as well. I'll give an update soon.

Thanks

If we weren't interested you wouldn't be on page 3. Lolll HK is also good stuff! Babysteps!

 

[Lalaloopsie]

RKevin1005, I fully understand what are you going through with your bullie and I am so sorry your furball suffers so much. I had all the same problems, looked for help everywhere and to make story short, what helped us was home cooked food (I feed him with boiled beef and potato I prepare myself), long course of antibiotic and special fish oil with high content of EPA and DHA. At the moment I travel and unfortunately have no opportunity to write in detail, but if you check my posts somewhere starting around September 2016 and further on, I described condition of my boy with pictures, and therapy we were prescribed. Three things you can be sure, 1) steroids is way to nowhere, they help now but kill later, 2)antiallergic med is just masking the problem and 3)eventually you will have to home cook or raw feed your dog. I am human doctor myself and also support the opinion, that food allergy tests are EXTREMELY expensive and inconclusive, especially in young dogs.