Overloaded with food info... Have to choose raw or high end commmercial...

[bigfwt04]

Ok, I am just know starting to see how deep the rabbit hole really goes with these little guys. Loving our little 10 week old guy to death, and besides a little cough that he is on antibiotics for he is happy and healthy.

We are currently feeding Kirkland Signature Premium Puppy, mixed with Kirkland premium wet food as the breeder suggested since that is what they feed.
After trying to read up on food I find I have even more questions that I started with

I am very intrigued by a raw diet, but as with most I am overwhelmed by the complexity to start it and the large gray areas that exist. Is there any such thing as a quick start guide or something with more guidance and specific bullet points?

We want the very best for Chunk but don't know whether to start with a very high end food like Fromm or jump right in with raw. We do know that we don't want to be complacent and wait until we have an issue to try different foods.

I would appreciate any solid info on plans on starting and implementing a raw diet at this age or what food we can buy that are better than what he is eating now.

Thanks everyone and I look forward to your feedback.

 

[Lindathedogsmaid]

OK down into the rabbit hole you go !
if --you can afford to feed raw . do so --ONLY if you can guarantee the source !!! that the meat is E COLI /SALMONELLA free!!!! you know the butcher GREAT---- feed raw !!!! nothing like it for 100% great health of your dog.
RAW is best IF____you can afford it, and the safety is there.
many folks have done so without worrying,but are playing Russian roulette!!!
I wont do that to my dogs!!! and do not forget the vitamins,and calcium. if long term is the goal. good luck, quantities are not hard to figure out.

don't know the butcher-or trust them with your new puppies LIFE--
feed one of 2--that right 2 brands, that have everything the pup will need, Fromm even at 60 lbs,1/2 cup will do 2 x a day!while a pup until 6 months. 3/4 cup 3 x a day!!!!!! then 1/2 cup 2 x a day
or great 4 life>>> that is your only choices for bulldogs. with no life long silent internal damage!!!!
the reason your breeder feeds Kirkland is they are not great smart people who care about the long term effects on their dogs, they do not keep them for more than 4 to 6 years to see the damage they have done on the dogs bodies.
those of us in rescue see the effects on the dogs when we get them in with life long damage to organs, skin, deafness due to ear infections that have gone unattended due t expense of the vets ((who by the way get very little training in nutrition, and take the salesman's word for the exchange of a kick back to the college of their choice , in the form of CASH ) if you need a vet--or a TV ADD to sell food!!!!! run the other way!!!! it is the most costly part of business--a good food doesn't advertise~~~~ they let word of mouth do it.with proof, and a great guarantee on the bag ,that is legal and binding in COURT. as to what is in the guaranteed analysis portion of the ingredient listing. and MUSCLE MEAT as the meat. prime cut grade A muscle meat!!! the roasts and such that we buy -with no cartilage,bones,contents,in it.
if your dog is allergic to a meat in the 4 star section take it back to where to got it((Hopefully via petflow.com -delivered to your door for $4.95 a bag)) the choose another meat base that will work well.for free.

 

[2BullyMama]

Tagging a few raw feeders for you [MENTION=1209]savemejeebus[/MENTION] [MENTION=2242]karenben[/MENTION] [MENTION=1906]GatorRay[/MENTION] and of course, the food ingredient guru [MENTION=2291]cowsmom[/MENTION]

 

[karenben]

***Link Deleted*** forum hi this is where i personaly would start they are a fantastic group soooo much knowledge and very helpful,they also do a barf section now,all i know is for my dog raw is best,freshness,quality,different menus daily,the only problem i have feeding raw is portion size lol,i give her a pound a day but am always tempted to give her more and now she is a little over weight lol so on a doggy diet,good luck with your research and hope raw is for you,karen

 

[cowsmom]

well you could always start on the fromm and then read up on the raw. i know people that jump right in and some that read up and there are several forums on raw to ask questions and such. there are several threads that have the websites listed. just punch in raw and see what comes up. i myself am considering raw but want to do more research and ask some questions before i do it. raw is the best way to go from all i have read and heard. if you decide to go kibble fromm is a good place to start and there are others that i can help you with. let us know what you decide.

 

[anatess]

Kirtland is actually a good product. If you look at their ingredients listing, they don't use any meat by-products. Instead they use the actual meat and meat meal - chicken meal or lamb meal - not generic magic-meat meal - as their first 2 ingredients. A dog food with the meat source as the first 2 ingredients is a good sign. And meat sources in meal form is pure protein.

Kirtland and Fromm 4 star have the same profile. High protein, low carbs with a specific meat source and no plant-derived protein boosters. If you see something that has the name by-products - like chicken by-products - it is not a good meat source. If you see something that has a generic meat source - like poultry meal - then it's almost a guarantee it came from rendering plants that are supplied by questionable sources like roadkill or kill shelters.

What makes Fromm better is their claim of using only meats that are USDA-inspected. Dogs have a different digestive systems than humans - unlike humans, dogs can eat spoiled meat and not get sick from it. They can eat meat rolling around in the dirt and not get sick from that. Of course, meats fit for human consumption is going to be good for dogs. But meats not fit for human consumption does not necessarily mean it is bad for dogs.

If your dog is doing okay with Kirtland, I wouldn't change it while you're investigating the raw diet. Raw is, of course, the best choice if you can manage it. Prey model raw is, in my opinion, the best model. If you're not going to go raw and you can afford it, then changing to Fromm 4-star Grain-free is a good choice if your dog does not have problems with it (i.e., allergies, etc.).

Hope this helps.

 

[Bella'sMom]

we have a great food rating here on EBN. I have also refered to this site from time to time. http://www.dogfoodadvisor.com/

Raw food is great for them, again if you can afford it. There a companies out there that make pre-raw patties, so they did the reserch for you. If you want to do it your self, then research the dogs needs.

 

[RescueMe]

I kind of got thrown into the raw feeding. Caleb is raw fed because that way he only poops once a day. Gracie starts dehydrated raw on Friday. I am using the Sojos brand. Will let you know how that goes.

 

[Poppy]

I just wanted to note that, although raw is more expensive at the beginning, once you get a handle on it and get your meat sources in order, it becomes the same cost if not less than kibble. It took 2-3 months for me to educate and familiarize myself with prices, cuts of meat, sources, etc. while feeding the pre ground raw patties. That has been my personal experience. This link will help with everything you need to know: http://www.petforums.co.uk/dog-health-nutrition/111437-raw-feeding-everything-you-need-know.html

Oregon might have a raw food co-op with locals that can help you with sourcing meat..

Some links:***Link Deleted***

If you go the route with kibble there are some great brands out there, I fed Orijen Red to my two bulldogs, it was the closest to being skin problem free for us, but their gas was still pretty bad.

 

[izstigspunks]

As with all food choices, research is key, especially when you're delving into something alien at first. I personally use the Yahoo rawfeeding group for any specific querries, especially newbie questions such as the types of meats and sizes of them to feed. The archives carry a wealth of info. Don't be afraid to ask questions, even if they seem really simple. I find these are the ones that confuse everyone initially.

 

[bigfwt04]

Isn't there a middle ground between raw and commercial food? Why can't you cook the meat for them instead of raw so you don't have to worry about any bacteria? Wouldn't that still be better than the commercial foods?

If I wanted to switch to Fromm's which ones would I want? The pink bag puppy? Anything else with it like a wet food?

 

[izstigspunks]

Isn't there a middle ground between raw and commercial food? Why can't you cook the meat for them instead of raw so you don't have to worry about any bacteria? Wouldn't that still be better than the commercial foods?

If I wanted to switch to Fromm's which ones would I want? The pink bag puppy? Anything else with it like a wet food?

A lot of the nutrients disappear when you cook food. But it's not an uncommon practice. But remember that it's dangerous to give our guys cooked bones. That's where people get confused.

The way I handle the raw meat for our guys is the same as how I handle raw meat for our consumption. There's not really a big difference except that I separate theirs in the daily portions so I only need to defrost 1 day's worth at a time.

You can pretty much choose any Fromm flavour. They're an all-stages food. But a lot choose the puppy formula if their babies are still puppies. Then transition them to an adult formula around 6 months of age. In my opinion, it's best to keep things simple and start with 1 food first, instead of mixing it with other wet or dry food. It's only because there's a chance that your guy will have an allergy to the food, and by starting with 1, you'll be able to eliminate the culprit much easier. Once you determine that your guy has a rock solid tummy, then proceed with giving him 'fancier' things.

 

[acarabias]

I feed my puppies raw, they love it, only poop twice a day and have beautiful coats.. they do have tear stains, and not sure why? I have a commercial grinder that grinds the bones and meat; I have older dogs at home with no teeth or very weak teeth and they cannot chew at all. I am thinking about introducing the eb puppies to carcasses, but not sure either since they just swallow everything and never chew. I'm afraid they'll choke.. And with all respect to the first post; any meat yo get from the grocery store or butcher is certified for human consumption, or human grade, so it is OK to feed your pups

 

[sowdie]

I feed my bully the raw patties. There are a number of brands to choose from and I'm seeing more and more of them pop up, but I use Nature's Variety. It's expensive, but it was even more expensive bringing Lola to the vet every other week for her allergies. She's been great ever since. Good weight, soft, shiny coat, and 1 poop a day.

 

[Lindathedogsmaid]

Please forgive me for adding some things-- But I need t clarify-- some issues regarding meat used in foods, and just what the USDA does and is -- the usda simply inspects that the protein is inspected at time of slaughter,to comply with regulations.!! that is at slaughter---not after ----

What makes Fromm better is their claim of using only meats that are USDA-inspected.
on the surface Kirkland and Fromm may LOOK the same. they are both USDA inspected at slaughter, the the REALLY BIG DIFFERENCE IS ---KIRKLAND PROTEIN COMES from a RENDERING PLANT!!!! (THAT IS WHAT IS LEFT OVER FROM HUMAN CONSUMPTION! !!!!!!

WHILE THE FROMM--COMES STRAIGHT FROM THE---- BUTCHER--AND IS -MUSCLE MEAT((MEANING ,PRIME CUTS OF MEAT,THE ROASTS STEAKS,)) STRAIGHT FROM THE BUTCHER !!!! DAILY ,

IF A MEAT ISN'T MUSCLE MEAT, IT ISN'T PRIME CUT QUALITY!!!!
ask your self where you would like your protein to come from.??????

and Fromm, and great 4 life are the only 2 brands that include,the pre and pro biotics,(guaranteed in writing,---in the guaranteed---- analysis,)))on the bag-check it out, while other brands may state they have the pre and pro biotics in the food--they will not guarantee it in writing within the guaranteed analysis,in writing, that would be legally binding by law to have any given amount in the food!!!! Fromm does-and says how much!!! check it out.

all other brands of foods need additives like pre and pro biotics !!! and that includes the old stand by Natures variety !! they have not up graded the food lately!!!

I am just saying --there is a lot more to judging food than what appears on the labels,
join the truth about pet foods, and see. $17.95 per year. totally unbiased. but still
but at not quite good enough for Bulldogs. least you will find out the truth about package labels