What % of protein to shoot for?

[kaikousha]

Sooo...slightly long food tale here. We switched Thor from Royal Canin (ew) to Nature's Domain Salmon & Sweet Potato (grain free), did the gradual switch. Overall it's better (he used to have dandruff and bite his paws more) but now we have new problems. Ever since going full on Nature's Domain (about 3 weeks now) half the time his "business" is OK looking and firm (though we don't appreciate the fish odor) but the other half of the time it looks like sludge, for lack of a better word. Basically like if I threw his food in the blender with some water...grainy. Also the last few weeks he's been intermittently throwing up at arbitrary times, there's no pattern I can tell. He either throws up his water or throws up something that looks like that sludge mixture, like if his dog food was ground up somewhat. I'm not sure if that means he's not properly digesting it...?
Otherwise I guess his eye gunk is somewhat better, his coat is better and he bites his paws less. Gas is much worse though.

The BF thinks I'm being a little switch-happy but I don't want this to be his norm. I went to our local pet store and looked at some other foods today...the only thing they don't have is Fromm. What I'm not sure of...the Nature's Domain is 24% protein. I was looking at some today that are 32-35%. What is a good protein level to shoot for with him? He's 4 1/2 months old, about 25-30 lbs. He's on the lanky side. I've heard the arguments for and against high protein for bullies, but this is my first baby and I just don't know

Since his problems are intermittent should I try a food switch first? BF also wanted to take him into the vet if this keeps up.

Bonus dog again

 

[JAKEISGREAT]

Sounds like an allergy to something in food. I'm going to get @cowsmom here..she's our "Food Queen"!!
Oyyyyyy..


My jake is allergic to chicken..and very sensitive to salmon!

 

[kaikousha]

really! I wonder if salmon is just not his protein, then. we're trying to avoid that darn $300 allergy test

 

[JAKEISGREAT]

really! I wonder if salmon is just not his protein, then. we're trying to avoid that darn $300 allergy test

I know..no one wants to spend the money for it..but look at it this way..how much will you save by not wasting a bunch of dog food and how much better your Thor will feel! Now mind you...I haven't gotten the test either..but it didn't take me much to figure out!i Chicken is a real problem with lots of Bullys..the salmon is not as common..but we have some here who are salmon challenged! You could try a good grain free..no chicken or salmon. Maybe Fromm Beef Fritatta? Or I just switched Jake to Earthborn Holistic Great Plains Feast..grain free and bison is the protein.

 

[RescueMe]

I agree it sounds like something in there isnt agreeing with him.Mine do that with chicken

 

[kaikousha]

I was actually reading through that Earthborn Holistic thread...it definitely seems like something worth trying for him. I just remember reading on the Top 5 recommended foods page here on EBN that Merrick was recommended because of the low protein, and NVI had a warning about high protein, seems like Earthborn great plains sits at 34% and I just want to make sure that's not going to cause him problems :s He's active but we both work and he sleeps all day

 

[JAKEISGREAT]

If he's a healthy active Bully..I've been told its fine...in fact it is helpful..[MENTION=2291]cowsmom[/MENTION] can explain it better than I!

 

[RescueMe]

The more active the bully the higher the protein they can tolerate. I have mine on 30% protein and they are fine.

 

[cowsmom]

Well I would try a food change with these symptoms. If you are worried with the protein earthborn has a lower protein food meadows feast I believe is 25% protein and grain free. I haven't had a puppy so not sure of protein for one. I would think maybe a bit older for the higher than 30% protein .

 

[RescueMe]

Most puppy formulas have 32 percent in them so should be ok.

 

[kaikousha]

Well thank you guys for the input!...I ordered a bag of earthborn holistic great plains for him today, should be here Tuesday...if that doesn't pan out maybe the EB meadowsfeast. Otherwise I'll see if my pet people can special order fromm!

 

[anatess]

Dogs have natural carnivore bias. What this means - their bodies are designed to process animal proteins and fats very efficiently. Carbs, not as much. And, even in proteins, animal proteins is more easily digestable to dogs than plant proteins. But, of course, you can't make kibble without carbs because you need the starch to make the dough that binds the meat together into kibble. But, vegetable protein is better than grain protein for digestability in dogs, hence the push for Grain-Free dog food that uses the starch from vegetables like potatoes or peas instead of rice or corn. By the way, allergies are caused by proteins that are not getting broken down properly in the stomach, so they enter the small intestines and trigger the immune system to attack them thinking they're bad invaders from Mars or something. Since proteins from grains are harder to digest, then they have a high likelihood of causing allergies.

When looking at dog food for a healthy dog without special medical needs, the amount of carbohydrates is what you need to look out for because this number is what can harm your dogs more than the protein. Dogs do not have the proper enzymes like bears and humans do that can break down carbs efficiently. The crazy thing is Carbs is not required in the dog food label so you have to calculate that yourself. I do not feed kibble that has carb content over 50%. I estimate carbs using Protein and fat content that is required on the label in the US. Now, naturally, high protein food is low in carbs. So, the higher the protein, the lower the carbs and vice versa. I use the "guesstimate" formula of 100% - (Protein%+Fat%+Moisture%+Ash%). Now, Ash (what is left of the dog food after you burn the thing - which is the vitamins and minerals that do not transform to heat energy) is usually around 8% in a good quality dog food, so I just guesstimate it at that. So now, the formula becomes Carbs%=100%-(Protein%+Fat%+Moisture%+8%).

Now, you will hear that Bully's are very lazy dogs so they don't need a lot of energy from their food - otherwise, they're going to become fat. And, the knee-jerk reaction to this is always - so I have to feed him low protein. I don't agree with this. Because - low protein usually means high carbs... and if there is anything that can make a dog fat and unhealthy it is the high carb. So, Bully's are not usually the yippity energetic poodle type dogs, that is true, so if you're trying to prevent him from getting fat, don't exchange protein for carbs, lower his caloric intake by reducing the amount of food he eats.

Of course, a high protein food that derives most of its protein from a plant is not going to be good for your dog as a high protein food that derives most of its protein from an animal. And, to make matters even more complicated, some dogs are allergic to specific protein sources - that is, they have a hard time digesting those types of protein. So, you'll see some dogs are allergic to salmon, some allergic to chicken, some allergic to potatoes, some allergic to a jillion things... so high-protein of something your dog is allergic to is doubly bad for your dog!

Now, if your dog has liver or kidney problems, you don't want to feed him high protein food because protein will overload those weak systems and make it worse.

Now, how's that for information overload? LOL!