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  1. #25
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    Default Re: completely frustrated any suggestions ?

    I'm surprised they didn't give you diarreha pills that are meant for animals. I didn't find them to expensive in the least...When I asked about giving the bulldog pepto...my vet said that to much of it can cause issues to the liver...but immodium never heard of a dog taking that...curious as to why they didn't just give you pills that were for diarrhea which also has live cultures in them. At least that was what our vet told us..
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  2. #26
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    Default Re: completely frustrated any suggestions ?

    Quote Originally Posted by cadillactaste View Post
    I'm surprised they didn't give you diarreha pills that are meant for animals. I didn't find them to expensive in the least...When I asked about giving the bulldog pepto...my vet said that to much of it can cause issues to the liver...but immodium never heard of a dog taking that...curious as to why they didn't just give you pills that were for diarrhea which also has live cultures in them. At least that was what our vet told us..
    he told us he could give us a prescription for diarreha pills but he felt the immodium worked just as well and much cheaper
    He also only wants us to give once every 8 hours until he is completely firm. ( he said this was his opinion that we could also just stick with the bland diet) which I feel is working , his bowels are semi soft now? I was more upset that he threw up the bile today that is why I took him.. I am just not sure whether or not to give to him?
    Last edited by BabyDuke; 04-08-2011 at 01:17 PM.

  3. #27
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    Default Re: completely frustrated any suggestions ?

    This is my personal opinion so take it for what it is worth:

    Duke is a puppy, puppies get diarrhea. Keep him in the bland diet and wait for his stools to firm up. Once they firm up, introduce the kibble again and see what happens.

    I appreciate you wanting to call your vet but what can he really tell by not examining Duke? How does he know it is not some kind of bug in the digestive system.

    I don't think it is necessary to give Immodium or any other medication until you give the bland diet a chance to work and let his system settle down.

    The throwing up isn't a big deal. As others have said, it happens when bullies have empty stomachs sometimes (Linus does this in the morning if I feed too early) - so it's a good sign. You know he's emptied out and now you can feed bland diet and give him a chance to slowly feel better.

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    Default Re: completely frustrated any suggestions ?

    Yes! We have used immodium on dogs with success..just be careful..as usual can cause constipation ! We keep that in our earthquake kit for critters..I'll be right over for a drink! Margarita ok!

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    Default Re: completely frustrated any suggestions ?

    Quote Originally Posted by sheshistory View Post
    This is my personal opinion so take it for what it is worth:

    Duke is a puppy, puppies get diarrhea. Keep him in the bland diet and wait for his stools to firm up. Once they firm up, introduce the kibble again and see what happens.

    I appreciate you wanting to call your vet but what can he really tell by not examining Duke? How does he know it is not some kind of bug in the digestive system.

    I don't think it is necessary to give Immodium or any other medication until you give the bland diet a chance to work and let his system settle down.

    The throwing up isn't a big deal. As others have said, it happens when bullies have empty stomachs sometimes (Linus does this in the morning if I feed too early) - so it's a good sign. You know he's emptied out and now you can feed bland diet and give him a chance to slowly feel better.
    I hope I am not out of turn..Duke is ..I think..3 years old..sorry if I am out of place!

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    Default Re: completely frustrated any suggestions ?

    Quote Originally Posted by JAKEISGREAT View Post
    I hope I am not out of turn..Duke is ..I think..3 years old..sorry if I am out of place!
    You are right he is 3 1/2 .. I am sorry to be so upset.. he is 3 1/2 and while he has had issues with allergies etc. this is the first time he has been sick.. he never got sick even as a puppy so I am just concerned

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    Default Re: completely frustrated any suggestions ?

    Quote Originally Posted by BabyDuke View Post
    You are right he is 3 1/2 .. I am sorry to be so upset.. he is 3 1/2 and while he has had issues with allergies etc. this is the first time he has been sick.. he never got sick even as a puppy so I am just concerned
    Don't ever apologize for loving your Duke and worrying about him..that's your job!

  8. #32
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    Default Re: completely frustrated any suggestions ?

    I have been following your story, but wanted to do a bit of research before I responded.

    The ingredients in your previous food are this:

    Dried Potatoes, Duck, Potato Protein, Cane Molasses, Canola Oil, Natural Flavor, Natural Mixed Tocopherols, Natural Hickory Smoke Flavor, Citric Acid, Rosemary Extract.
    GUARANTEED ANALYSIS
    Crude Protein 13% minimum
    Crude Fat 7.0% minimum
    Crude Fiber 4.0% maximum
    Moisture 10.0% maximum

    This product is intended for intermittent or supplemental feeding only.
    This is taken from the website of natural balance.

    You have essentially COMPLETELY changed your Baby Duke's Diet.

    Here are the ingredients in NVI Beef:
    Beef Meal, Lamb Meal, Turkey Meal, Tapioca, Beef Fat, Pea Starch, Beef Liver, Beef Plasma, Natural Lamb Flavor, Coconut Oil, Sun-Cured Alfalfa Meal, Tomato Pomace, Montmorillonite Clay, Vitamins (Choline Chloride, Vitamin E Supplement, Ascorbic Acid, Biotin, Niacin Supplement, Vitamin A Acetate, d-Calcium Pantothenate, Riboflavin Supplement, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Thiamine Mononitrate, Vitamin B12 Supplement, Carotene, Vitamin D3 Supplement, Folic Acid), Potassium Chloride, Minerals (Zinc Proteinate, Iron Proteinate, Manganese Proteinate, Copper Proteinate, Sodium Selenite, Ethylenediamine Dihydriodide), Sea Salt, Dried Kelp, Direct-Fed Microorganisms (Saccharomyces Cerevisiae Yeast Culture, Dried Enterococcus Faecium Fermentation Product, Dried Lactobacillus Acidophilus Fermentation Product, Dried Aspergillus Niger Fermentation Extract, Dried Trichoderma Longibrachiatum Fermentation Extract, Dried Bacillus Subtilis Fermentation Extract), Taurine, Carrots, Garlic, Apples, Pumpkin, Inulin, Mixed Tocopherols with Citric Acid (a natural preservative), Rosemary Extract, Freeze Dried Beef, Freeze Dried Beef Heart, Freeze Dried Beef Liver, Pumpkinseeds, Ground Beef Bone, Butternut Squash, Ground Flaxseeds, Chicken Eggs, Broccoli, Lettuce, Spinach, Apple Cider Vinegar, Parsley, Honey, Salmon Oil, Olive Oil, Blueberries, Alfalfa Sprouts, Persimmons, Duck Eggs, Pheasant Eggs, Quail Eggs, Rosemary, Sage, Clove.
    Guaranteed Analysis
    Crude Protein (min): 37.0%
    Crude Fat (min): 20.0%
    Crude Fiber (max): 3.5%
    Moisture (max): 10.0%
    My theory is that you switched the food too quickly. Because of the completely different variations of ingredients here, it has given Duke a tummy ache. A bad one.

    As far as the poo being fine and firm for (6?) days, that would be expected, as it really does take a few days for it to get through their system.

    Let me elaborate on this, because many years ago, our bully Sarah (the highly allergic one) was fine one day, and the next day she was pooing like crazy. She could not hold it. The look of terror in her eyes was so sad, I could not get mad. The poo consistancy was different tho, like almost 'foamy'---because it was full of gas..... I would give her 1 cup of food but she would poop out 6 cups. It was crazy, and yes there was a liquidy blood with it. After going to the vet, he asked me if I had made any changes to her diet recently. Well, I had switched her (slowly) from Iams puppy to Iams Lamb and rice- I KNOW YUK!!!! RIGHT???!!!! And this was about a week before this started happening. She was just turning 1 so I wanted to change her to adult food. Well, come to find out she was HIGHLY allergic to 3 of the ingredients in the food after we had blood tests done on her, Lamb being the worst.

    My point of all this is that it does take time to see what happens with the food. I would also say that if it is causing any allergic reaction you may see poop consistancy of what I described.

    So my theory is one of two things:

    The food change happened way too fast, or you are giving too much of it per feeding. This is more than likely the case I think. This caused swelling in his GI tract.

    The other is a possible allergy to one of the ingredients. Beef is considered a 'hot' food, many dogs do have allergies to this, but it is better than chicken usually. I don't think this is the case, however, because the poo was not that bad, and he was already tested for food allergies in the past (although they can develop later, so it is not impossible that he does not have any food allergies now).

    So what now? What do you do?

    Do the bland diet for a couple of days. Once things firm up, slowly start introducing the Nature's Variety into his diet.

    Start with 1 cup of rice, and 1/4 cup of kibble. Do this for about 5 days and make sure all is still well. Then go to 1/3c kibble. (5 days) Then 1/2c kibble. (5 days) Then 3/4c kibble (5 days). Then decrease the rice amount to 1/2c (5 days) then none at all. Normally a food change should not have to go to such EXTREME measures, but this is to make sure there is no upset on his digestive system at all.

    I don't think you should stick with the limited ingredient duck and potato because I don't think he is getting enough vitamins and protien. That food is used to try to identify a food allergy. Since he is not allergic to food, there is no reason he should be on this diet.

    ALSO--- too much potatoes in that diet. I honestly believe you will see a huge improvement once you successfully make the switch to NVI, and hopefully in the end all of this will be worth the effort you are making. When this happens, I hope you will type up the whole story, and share it with others in the Dog Food and Nutrition articles section. Please keep us updated!

    P.S. I also think it is unnecessary to give the tummy medicine at this point if his poops are improving and does not seem to be in any physical pain. But it is good to know for future emergencies!

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  9. #33
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    Default Re: completely frustrated any suggestions ?

    Quote Originally Posted by desertskybulldogs View Post
    I have been following your story, but wanted to do a bit of research before I responded.

    The ingredients in your previous food are this:


    This is taken from the website of natural balance.

    You have essentially COMPLETELY changed your Baby Duke's Diet.

    Here are the ingredients in NVI Beef:




    My theory is that you switched the food too quickly. Because of the completely different variations of ingredients here, it has given Duke a tummy ache. A bad one.

    As far as the poo being fine and firm for (6?) days, that would be expected, as it really does take a few days for it to get through their system.

    Let me elaborate on this, because many years ago, our bully Sarah (the highly allergic one) was fine one day, and the next day she was pooing like crazy. She could not hold it. The look of terror in her eyes was so sad, I could not get mad. The poo consistancy was different tho, like almost 'foamy'---because it was full of gas..... I would give her 1 cup of food but she would poop out 6 cups. It was crazy, and yes there was a liquidy blood with it. After going to the vet, he asked me if I had made any changes to her diet recently. Well, I had switched her (slowly) from Iams puppy to Iams Lamb and rice- I KNOW YUK!!!! RIGHT???!!!! And this was about a week before this started happening. She was just turning 1 so I wanted to change her to adult food. Well, come to find out she was HIGHLY allergic to 3 of the ingredients in the food after we had blood tests done on her, Lamb being the worst.

    My point of all this is that it does take time to see what happens with the food. I would also say that if it is causing any allergic reaction you may see poop consistancy of what I described.

    So my theory is one of two things:

    The food change happened way too fast, or you are giving too much of it per feeding. This is more than likely the case I think. This caused swelling in his GI tract.

    The other is a possible allergy to one of the ingredients. Beef is considered a 'hot' food, many dogs do have allergies to this, but it is better than chicken usually. I don't think this is the case, however, because the poo was not that bad, and he was already tested for food allergies in the past (although they can develop later, so it is not impossible that he does not have any food allergies now).

    So what now? What do you do?

    Do the bland diet for a couple of days. Once things firm up, slowly start introducing the Nature's Variety into his diet.

    Start with 1 cup of rice, and 1/4 cup of kibble. Do this for about 5 days and make sure all is still well. Then go to 1/3c kibble. (5 days) Then 1/2c kibble. (5 days) Then 3/4c kibble (5 days). Then decrease the rice amount to 1/2c (5 days) then none at all. Normally a food change should not have to go to such EXTREME measures, but this is to make sure there is no upset on his digestive system at all.

    I don't think you should stick with the limited ingredient duck and potato because I don't think he is getting enough vitamins and protien. That food is used to try to identify a food allergy. Since he is not allergic to food, there is no reason he should be on this diet.

    ALSO--- too much potatoes in that diet. I honestly believe you will see a huge improvement once you successfully make the switch to NVI, and hopefully in the end all of this will be worth the effort you are making. When this happens, I hope you will type up the whole story, and share it with others in the Dog Food and Nutrition articles section. Please keep us updated!

    P.S. I also think it is unnecessary to give the tummy medicine at this point if his poops are improving and does not seem to be in any physical pain. But it is good to know for future emergencies!

    Couldn't agree more, or say it better ... the only thing I could add, is that a fantastic food isn't fantastic for all bullys. Give this food about a month, and if it's not working try one of the other foods that come highly recommended on this site.

  10. #34
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    Default Re: completely frustrated any suggestions ?

    Quote Originally Posted by desertskybulldogs View Post
    I have been following your story, but wanted to do a bit of research before I responded.

    The ingredients in your previous food are this:


    This is taken from the website of natural balance.

    You have essentially COMPLETELY changed your Baby Duke's Diet.

    Here are the ingredients in NVI Beef:




    My theory is that you switched the food too quickly. Because of the completely different variations of ingredients here, it has given Duke a tummy ache. A bad one.

    As far as the poo being fine and firm for (6?) days, that would be expected, as it really does take a few days for it to get through their system.

    Let me elaborate on this, because many years ago, our bully Sarah (the highly allergic one) was fine one day, and the next day she was pooing like crazy. She could not hold it. The look of terror in her eyes was so sad, I could not get mad. The poo consistancy was different tho, like almost 'foamy'---because it was full of gas..... I would give her 1 cup of food but she would poop out 6 cups. It was crazy, and yes there was a liquidy blood with it. After going to the vet, he asked me if I had made any changes to her diet recently. Well, I had switched her (slowly) from Iams puppy to Iams Lamb and rice- I KNOW YUK!!!! RIGHT???!!!! And this was about a week before this started happening. She was just turning 1 so I wanted to change her to adult food. Well, come to find out she was HIGHLY allergic to 3 of the ingredients in the food after we had blood tests done on her, Lamb being the worst.

    My point of all this is that it does take time to see what happens with the food. I would also say that if it is causing any allergic reaction you may see poop consistancy of what I described.

    So my theory is one of two things:

    The food change happened way too fast, or you are giving too much of it per feeding. This is more than likely the case I think. This caused swelling in his GI tract.

    The other is a possible allergy to one of the ingredients. Beef is considered a 'hot' food, many dogs do have allergies to this, but it is better than chicken usually. I don't think this is the case, however, because the poo was not that bad, and he was already tested for food allergies in the past (although they can develop later, so it is not impossible that he does not have any food allergies now).

    So what now? What do you do?

    Do the bland diet for a couple of days. Once things firm up, slowly start introducing the Nature's Variety into his diet.

    Start with 1 cup of rice, and 1/4 cup of kibble. Do this for about 5 days and make sure all is still well. Then go to 1/3c kibble. (5 days) Then 1/2c kibble. (5 days) Then 3/4c kibble (5 days). Then decrease the rice amount to 1/2c (5 days) then none at all. Normally a food change should not have to go to such EXTREME measures, but this is to make sure there is no upset on his digestive system at all.

    I don't think you should stick with the limited ingredient duck and potato because I don't think he is getting enough vitamins and protien. That food is used to try to identify a food allergy. Since he is not allergic to food, there is no reason he should be on this diet.

    ALSO--- too much potatoes in that diet. I honestly believe you will see a huge improvement once you successfully make the switch to NVI, and hopefully in the end all of this will be worth the effort you are making. When this happens, I hope you will type up the whole story, and share it with others in the Dog Food and Nutrition articles section. Please keep us updated!

    P.S. I also think it is unnecessary to give the tummy medicine at this point if his poops are improving and does not seem to be in any physical pain. But it is good to know for future emergencies!
    wow can not tell you how much I appreciate all of this.. got home and he did have soft poop again and he threw up a little more bile. but he is acting fine. I sat on my sofa and cried my eyes out because I felt like I did this by changing his food ( like I said he has never been sick in the 3 years we have had him).. the right side of my brain knows from the research I did that the food I was trying was so much better for him but the left side ( the over sensitive knuckle head ) was kicking myself. so thank you thank you.. I will do exactly as said .. ironically this is what the vet told me today.. he said " I am 99 % sure this has happened because it was just too much too soon and a huge change.

    I am so sorry to be a pest but when I do start to introduce it again would I stick with the beef flavor? or do you suggest trying something different? from all the tests done he has no allergies to beef?

    thank you so much again for taking the time to send me this info!

  11. #35
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    Default Re: completely frustrated any suggestions ?

    Yes @desertskybulldogs..yes..I think this is what she should do too. I had to do almost this exact regime with Jake when I simply increased his food too quickly! It took me 6 or 7 days to get completely back on his kibble. Whew..I didn't realize beef was a trouble food until I read it here. Thanks for great info..as usual.

  12. #36
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    Default Re: completely frustrated any suggestions ?

    Quote Originally Posted by JAKEISGREAT View Post
    Yes @desertskybulldogs..yes..I think this is what she should do too. I had to do almost this exact regime with Jake when I simply increased his food too quickly! It took me 6 or 7 days to get completely back on his kibble. Whew..I didn't realize beef was a trouble food until I read it here. Thanks for great info..as usual.

    Yes it is, but for me, it is fine. The best choice usually for allergy food dogs is fish- but most fish foods do have some chicken in them. Since Tidus seems to have a major allergy to poultry I could not use fish formulas on him.

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