The Vet Confuses Me...Opinions Please!

Shahster

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Apr 13, 2013
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Hello!

I took Otis to a new vet today regarding his eye/interdigital cysts/scooting issues, and I came out more confused then ever.

She said Otis does need surgery and it'll cost just over 1000, which is WAY cheaper than the 3000 I was first quoted. BUT she said it might take a couple of surgeries for it to be perfected to due muscle movements and the way his folds lay on his face. She explained that the process is similar to a face lift? Is it normal to have multiple surgeries for entropion?

THEN, we started talking about his interdigital cysts (which seem to be going down now that he's on ground beef and sweet potatoes). He had one surgically removed at the end of April, and they kept it in case I decided to have tests done on it. This vet suggests that I do it because it will help determine which antibiotics he can have and it'll say if it's cancerous. She also said that he's scooting for the same reasons; it's some sort of reaction to "something". She also mentioned that she feels as if he'll be prone to cysts for the rest of his life, not sure how she came to that conclusion.

Now, I went in for a simple exam and with the hopes of getting an allergy test to see what exactly he's reacting to. They gave me an invoice totaling 950 dollars! I only paid for the exam and some wipes for his feet, saying that I need to think about the rest of the things they wanted me to do. Here's what was on the invoice, and I'm not sure if I should have them done because really I have no idea what they are and the vet wasn't there to inform me because she was asked to finish up because someone was waiting for her. The receptionist brought me the invoice and simply said "this is what you two talked about" and couldn't answer my questions.

-Nutriscan (full scan/hemopet)
-Culture and Sensitivity
-Swab fee
-Some sort of tablets....beta-thym
-UNDA remedies


Does anyone know what these are? Or any advice on what to do? Obviously if it'll help him I'll do it, but I'd like to understand what I'm putting him through.
 

sheshistory

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Jul 11, 2010
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Boy I wish I could help here but I am confused by the volume of information in your post. I have no experience with entropion but the article published in allergies might really help you!
 

Twice

My Bully Gave Me Wings
Feb 3, 2012
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Abby (my Sweetie Head 10.24.11-11.23.12) and Otis
wow. People walk in with a bulldog and vets really do see dollar signs!

I missed the back story on this one but if I'm reading it right, this is the second vet you've taken him to? Did the first vet say the same things? I've never heard of needing multiple etropion surgeries. There is only so much tissue they can cut! If that's the case with this doctor you're better off with the other doc who says only once. This guy might ending up charging you $1000 3 or 4 times.

I have to be honest and say that I've never heard of interdigital cysts being cancerous either. They are almost always caused by bacteria but I have heard speculation that they're allergy related.

Your post sent me to my old friend the Merck Veterinary Manual. If the cysts persist they will do a culture to figure out which is the best antibiotic for that particular bacteria but nowhere does it say if you get one you will have them forever.

http://www.merckmanuals.com/vet/int...is/overview_of_interdigital_furunculosis.html

What would I do? If the cysts are going down with the new food, stay on that food and see what happens. I certainly wouldn't rush to surgery just because this doctor says you should. Interdigital cysts are ugly, annoying and they can be painful but if he is getting better with what you are doing now I would wait to have his feet cut open. Soak his feet in Epsom salts, put some Preparation H on them to reduce the swelling and follow that up with a triple antibiotic cream. If they get worse or he shows any sign of pain, limping or oozing THEN get a scraping.

He scoots so he's having a reaction to something? Really? Did the guy even check his anal glands? 98% of the time that is the reason they scoot. Other reasons are an infection, parasite or tumor. Or maybe his butt just itches! lol We had a dog in foster last year who liked to rock back and forth on his butt, dragging it across the floor. Then one day his foster mother noticed that when he did it he was actually rubbing his personal bit on the ground giving himself a happy ending :laugh:sorry, that was more information than you probably needed :ROFL:
 

JAKEISGREAT

.................
Mar 25, 2011
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wow. People walk in with a bulldog and vets really do see dollar signs!

I missed the back story on this one but if I'm reading it right, this is the second vet you've taken him to? Did the first vet say the same things? I've never heard of needing multiple etropion surgeries. There is only so much tissue they can cut! If that's the case with this doctor you're better off with the other doc who says only once. This guy might ending up charging you $1000 3 or 4 times.

I have to be honest and say that I've never heard of interdigital cysts being cancerous either. They are almost always caused by bacteria but I have heard speculation that they're allergy related.

Your post sent me to my old friend the Merck Veterinary Manual. If the cysts persist they will do a culture to figure out which is the best antibiotic for that particular bacteria but nowhere does it say if you get one you will have them forever.

http://www.merckmanuals.com/vet/int...is/overview_of_interdigital_furunculosis.html

What would I do? If the cysts are going down with the new food, stay on that food and see what happens. I certainly wouldn't rush to surgery just because this doctor says you should. Interdigital cysts are ugly, annoying and they can be painful but if he is getting better with what you are doing now I would wait to have his feet cut open. Soak his feet in Epsom salts, put some Preparation H on them to reduce the swelling and follow that up with a triple antibiotic cream. If they get worse or he shows any sign of pain, limping or oozing THEN get a scraping.

He scoots so he's having a reaction to something? Really? Did the guy even check his anal glands? 98% of the time that is the reason they scoot. Other reasons are an infection, parasite or tumor. Or maybe his butt just itches! lol We had a dog in foster last year who liked to rock back and forth on his butt, dragging it across the floor. Then one day his foster mother noticed that when he did it he was actually rubbing his personal bit on the ground giving himself a happy ending :laugh:sorry, that was more information than you probably needed :ROFL:


I knew this vet was full of sumpin! Just needed your opinion! :cursing:
 

KentuckyBully

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That is a lot of information and to leave confused isn't a good thing. My suggestion would be to call and ask the same questions you are asking here to the vet or go for another opinion. How old is your bully? My pug, Sophie, who is now 14, was diagnosed with entropin as a puppy. She had nares surgery and her spay at the same time and while she was under they were able to examine her eyes really well. Since she was so young, they held off doing the surgery and said there was a chance it would reverse itself, which it did. From what I recall, if she were to have had the surgery, it would have been one procedure.
 

bullmama

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wow. People walk in with a bulldog and vets really do see dollar signs!

I missed the back story on this one but if I'm reading it right, this is the second vet you've taken him to? Did the first vet say the same things? I've never heard of needing multiple etropion surgeries. There is only so much tissue they can cut! If that's the case with this doctor you're better off with the other doc who says only once. This guy might ending up charging you $1000 3 or 4 times.

I have to be honest and say that I've never heard of interdigital cysts being cancerous either. They are almost always caused by bacteria but I have heard speculation that they're allergy related.

Your post sent me to my old friend the Merck Veterinary Manual. If the cysts persist they will do a culture to figure out which is the best antibiotic for that particular bacteria but nowhere does it say if you get one you will have them forever.

http://www.merckmanuals.com/vet/int...is/overview_of_interdigital_furunculosis.html

What would I do? If the cysts are going down with the new food, stay on that food and see what happens. I certainly wouldn't rush to surgery just because this doctor says you should. Interdigital cysts are ugly, annoying and they can be painful but if he is getting better with what you are doing now I would wait to have his feet cut open. Soak his feet in Epsom salts, put some Preparation H on them to reduce the swelling and follow that up with a triple antibiotic cream. If they get worse or he shows any sign of pain, limping or oozing THEN get a scraping.

He scoots so he's having a reaction to something? Really? Did the guy even check his anal glands? 98% of the time that is the reason they scoot. Other reasons are an infection, parasite or tumor. Or maybe his butt just itches! lol We had a dog in foster last year who liked to rock back and forth on his butt, dragging it across the floor. Then one day his foster mother noticed that when he did it he was actually rubbing his personal bit on the ground giving himself a happy ending :laugh:sorry, that was more information than you probably needed :ROFL:

Bev is exactly right! One surgery for entropion, unless your pup is young and has a lot of head growing to do, then maybe a second.

Looks like maybe the quote they gave was for a skin allergy test. That's a full blown reactive test. A blood test should be much cheaper but less accuracy.

Also scooting, likely Anal glands or tail pocket infection.

Here is that article on allergies:
http://www.englishbulldognews.com/c...llergies-Information-Treatment-and-Prevention





Sent from my iPhone 5 using Tapatalk :)
 
OP
Shahster

Shahster

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Boy I wish I could help here but I am confused by the volume of information in your post. I have no experience with entropion but the article published in allergies might really help you!


LOL! That's exactly how I felt sitting in the room. She gave me all sorts of information in 30 minutes, and then just left!!
 
OP
Shahster

Shahster

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wow. People walk in with a bulldog and vets really do see dollar signs!

I missed the back story on this one but if I'm reading it right, this is the second vet you've taken him to? Did the first vet say the same things? I've never heard of needing multiple etropion surgeries. There is only so much tissue they can cut! If that's the case with this doctor you're better off with the other doc who says only once. This guy might ending up charging you $1000 3 or 4 times.

I have to be honest and say that I've never heard of interdigital cysts being cancerous either. They are almost always caused by bacteria but I have heard speculation that they're allergy related.

Your post sent me to my old friend the Merck Veterinary Manual. If the cysts persist they will do a culture to figure out which is the best antibiotic for that particular bacteria but nowhere does it say if you get one you will have them forever.

http://www.merckmanuals.com/vet/int...is/overview_of_interdigital_furunculosis.html

What would I do? If the cysts are going down with the new food, stay on that food and see what happens. I certainly wouldn't rush to surgery just because this doctor says you should. Interdigital cysts are ugly, annoying and they can be painful but if he is getting better with what you are doing now I would wait to have his feet cut open. Soak his feet in Epsom salts, put some Preparation H on them to reduce the swelling and follow that up with a triple antibiotic cream. If they get worse or he shows any sign of pain, limping or oozing THEN get a scraping.

He scoots so he's having a reaction to something? Really? Did the guy even check his anal glands? 98% of the time that is the reason they scoot. Other reasons are an infection, parasite or tumor. Or maybe his butt just itches! lol We had a dog in foster last year who liked to rock back and forth on his butt, dragging it across the floor. Then one day his foster mother noticed that when he did it he was actually rubbing his personal bit on the ground giving himself a happy ending :laugh:sorry, that was more information than you probably needed :ROFL:


Hello!

Yes, this is the second vet I've taken him to. The first vet just said that Otis needs surgery, they don't perform that surgery there, and that it should be a one time thing at the animal hospital.

Right now, Otis is eating ground beef and boiled sweet potatoes and his paw looks SO much better. I gave him some of his kibble (Fromm pork and peas) and there's definitely something in there that's triggering his cysts. Can he eat ground beef/sweet potatoes forever? I'm afraid he's missing out on some nutrients. I soak it in epsom salts and sometimes apple cider vinegar.

I'm pretty sure the scooting is because of an infection. I had my old vet express his glands in April, but the scooting persisted. So I went to petsmart to express them again, and she said Otis has an infection. The vet looked in his tail pocket and mumbled something whoever clipped Otis' tail did a bad job and basically said whatever is irritating his paw, is irritating his tail pocket. I'm 100% sure it's infected it smells horrible and there's a certain spot that really hurts him all of a sudden when I'm cleaning him. Why wouldn't she give me some sort of cream for him?

ALSO, I looked at the wipes she sent me home with and they're just surface cleaner/disinfectants. For his paws...? Is that normal?


Thanks for your help!
 
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Shahster

Shahster

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That is a lot of information and to leave confused isn't a good thing. My suggestion would be to call and ask the same questions you are asking here to the vet or go for another opinion. How old is your bully? My pug, Sophie, who is now 14, was diagnosed with entropin as a puppy. She had nares surgery and her spay at the same time and while she was under they were able to examine her eyes really well. Since she was so young, they held off doing the surgery and said there was a chance it would reverse itself, which it did. From what I recall, if she were to have had the surgery, it would have been one procedure.

I tried asking questions over the phone with them and they only say to make an appointment with the vet because she's better at providing me answers..lol. Otis is 4 years old, I just got him in February so I'm not even sure how long he's been battling these eye problems.

Thanks for your help!
 
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Shahster

Shahster

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Bev is exactly right! One surgery for entropion, unless your pup is young and has a lot of head growing to do, then maybe a second.

Looks like maybe the quote they gave was for a skin allergy test. That's a full blown reactive test. A blood test should be much cheaper but less accuracy.

Also scooting, likely Anal glands or tail pocket infection.

Here is that article on allergies:
http://www.englishbulldognews.com/c...llergies-Information-Treatment-and-Prevention





Sent from my iPhone 5 using Tapatalk :)


She mentioned they swabbed his mouth for the allergy test. I think I might just call my old vet, make an appointment for an allergy test and figure out what to feed him.

I'm pretty sure his tail pocket is infected. I'll check that article out. THANKS!
 

cali~jenn

..........
Mar 28, 2010
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Wow! I would get another opinion. Do you have a good bully vet? If you can get in with one it might help here. Mii always booty scoots. With her it is just itchiness/allergies I think. It sounds to me this vet is surgery happy and as dangerous as surgeries are for bullies that in itself would have me out the door in a heartbeat. Glad you r here to get answers!
 

cowsmom

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Apr 27, 2011
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well thats alot of stuff. i would thing only one surgery would be needed and um sounds to me like they are going to remove some of his folds on his face. wtf? cysts are usually food related and seems like you have kinda discovered that with them going down on the food your feeding. sarah had them for years till i narrowed down her allergies. with bullies its find their protein and then work out from their. the butt scooting could be anals or tp problems or just allergies. i would surly get another opinion from a vet before i get all that stuff done. perhaps just a blood allergy test which is cheaper. its not perfect but will help narrow things down.
 

Twice

My Bully Gave Me Wings
Feb 3, 2012
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Woodbridge Township, NJ
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@Shahster

Yes, this is the second vet I've taken him to. The first vet just said that Otis needs surgery, they don't perform that surgery there, and that it should be a one time thing at the animal hospital.

Take him to an ophthalmologist if possible, if he does need surgery you will want the best person possible for the job. It might cost you a little more but the risks are considerably lower when an expert does it.

Right now, Otis is eating ground beef and boiled sweet potatoes and his paw looks SO much better. I gave him some of his kibble (Fromm pork and peas) and there's definitely something in there that's triggering his cysts. Can he eat ground beef/sweet potatoes forever? I'm afraid he's missing out on some nutrients. I soak it in epsom salts and sometimes apple cider vinegar.

Sound to me like he may be sensitive to pork or the peas. @cowsmom 's sarah is allergic to peas so it's very possible Otis is too. My Otis is sensitive to pork. I would stick with the rice and ground beef for a little while to settle his system then start adding a little bit of another protein source in there to see how he reacts. If you like Fromm they do make other flavors. :)

I'm pretty sure the scooting is because of an infection. I had my old vet express his glands in April, but the scooting persisted. So I went to petsmart to express them again, and she said Otis has an infection. The vet looked in his tail pocket and mumbled something whoever clipped Otis' tail did a bad job and basically said whatever is irritating his paw, is irritating his tail pocket. I'm 100% sure it's infected it smells horrible and there's a certain spot that really hurts him all of a sudden when I'm cleaning him. Why wouldn't she give me some sort of cream for him?

"whoever clipped his tail"?????? :blink: Really? :laugh: Do Otis a favor, find a vet with some bulldog experience please lol This lady sounds like she has never met a bully in her life.

ALSO, I looked at the wipes she sent me home with and they're just surface cleaner/disinfectants. For his paws...? Is that normal?

Can I ask the name of the wipes she sent you home with? A lot of folks here on EBN love the Malacetic wipes for cleaning. You should be able to buy them at the pet store, if not Amazon sells them pretty cheap. You can try to gently clean his tail pocket yourself with some witch hazel on a gauze pad then maybe squirt some Gold Bond powder up in there to help keep it dry. If he is very sensitive to the touch in that area you can spray him with some Lanacane to help with the pain. This should start to help him until you see a vet for antibiotics.

Thanks for your help!

Datz wut we hear for! :D
 
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Shahster

Shahster

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[MENTION=4225]Twice[/MENTION]

My next step is making an appointment with an ophthalmologist. I really don't like the fact that hemight require more than one surgery for his eyes. I'd rather have someone do it right the first time. I'll stick with what I'm feeding him for now, he does well on salmon too. So I just have to find a grain free one for him.

He was using malacetic wipes on his paws and she sent me home with a big tub of "Accel Prevention" wipes. It looks more like a disinfectant for medical equipment. She said it's better for him because it provides more oxygen to kill the bacteria (or maybe vice versa). I've been using witch hazel and gold bond on his tail, so hopefully it starts to kick in soon.

I'm going to go through the vet recommendation post to see if there's a bully vet in Toronto for me.
 

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